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New Poll - Dreams of being pro?
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When we used to run the 'portfolio' series in the magazine 8/10 answers to the question 'Photographic Ambition?' was 'To turn professional'. I wonder though if turning professional is what many amateurs actually want to do or if it is one of those fantasies that is best left as a dream. Do you really want to turn professional, and how do you think it would effect your relationship with photography if you did? If you are professional already has photography changed for you from the times you were an amateur?
What prompted this discussion was seeing a mixed professional and amateur exhibition recently. All the professional work was very good - but not much of it was very interesting. The amateur work wasn't all very good, but it was all interesting and seemed to contain much more passion.
It doesn't have to be that way, and it isn't always, but I wonder what you think the relationship is between passion and profession.
Head to the Home Page to vote.
Thanks again for taking part.
Damien
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Re: New Poll - Dreams of being pro?
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That's a tricky one. I certainly want to become more "professional" in my approach and I do want to start to have a good second income through photography to fund kit. My problem is that I'm at the worng time of life to think about working towards being a full time pro. With a 2year old daughter, hefty mortgage and being the main bread winner, we can't afford the risk setting up on your own entails.
I am working towards becoming semi-pro which would keep things open for me.
As for the difference between pro and amateur's materials, would you say that that might come down to amateurs shooting for themselves while (good) pro's are used to shooting for others. Maybe it's a lesson for pro's to always have a personal project to keep them interested.
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gollum
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(enthusiast)
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03/05/2008 11:29
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Re: New Poll - Dreams of being pro?
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I think the main problem here is what we usually do for a living is usually a means to an end, and photography is a way of escaping that. Would you really want to come home from work and carry on doing what you had been doing all day?
On the other hand it must be nice to do something you enjoy and have passion for.
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Dave_Cox
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(old'n'grumpy)
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03/05/2008 11:31
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Re: New Poll - Dreams of being pro?
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I would like to sell some of my work, mainly to fund the hobby; but I don't see me taking the plunge full time. I tried it many years ago as a model maker, and suddenly all the fun had gone from my hobby.
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OneTen
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('Two Breakfasts')
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03/05/2008 12:01
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Re: New Poll - Dreams of being pro?
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When I first started out I would shoot anything to try and make money with my camera. Local sporting events, amateur dramatics, charity events and sold to the participants and their families. Shooting the dress rehearsal for am-dram was probably the most lucrative. For little outlay I would generate sales from each of the cast. I'd offered to do their publicity shots for free as a foot in the door. 
I ran a successful wedding and portrait business for a couple of years but I lost interest, I was more of a salesman than a photographer. What really killed it off for me was trying to sell travel images, the ones that sold were just the same as everyone elses and the photos that I liked and enjoyed taking didn't sell. I ended up only shooting what I thought would sell and this change in direction was too much. Now it's strictly for fun only.
I don't think you have to be that good a photographer to make money with a camera, it's more down to hard work, persistance, a bit of luck and a bit of gab.
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Re: New Poll - Dreams of being pro?
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It is difficult to imagine anything that I want less . . . . . 
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Re: New Poll - Dreams of being pro?
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wouldn't mind making some money out of it to fund kit expansion - but that is about it
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Nod
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(Carpal \'Tunnel)
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03/05/2008 12:49
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Re: New Poll - Dreams of being pro?
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Having moved into jobs related to hobbies or making money from hobbies a couple of times, I can honestly say that I have no intention of turning pro. I may sell the occasional print and might be persuaded to take one or two pics in exchange for a favour - but to make proper money? No way!
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Re: New Poll - Dreams of being pro?
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One of the draws to becoming a semi-pro is to be able to gain access to events/places that otherwise would be out of bounds. I have sympathy with the ethos that work spoils an enjoyable hobby, I found it myself with sport, but there are those who are able to make money from photography and still have a passion for it, and because of it they tend to also be successful at it enabling them to pick and choose what they shoot. It can be a self fulfilling prophesy in that way.
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Re: New Poll - Dreams of being pro?
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Nothing like doing it for a living to kill your enthusiasm.
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Bettina
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(Kein Titel)
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03/05/2008 15:39
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Re: New Poll - Dreams of being pro?
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Quote:
I don't think you have to be that good a photographer to make money with a camera, it's more down to hard work, persistance, a bit of luck and a bit of gab.
You have to be a good business man or woman in the first place - which I'm not. In fact, I'm thinking of turning amateur again ... 
There are zillions of mediocre professional photographers out there.
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Zou
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(Pooh-Bah)
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03/05/2008 21:24
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Re: New Poll - Dreams of being pro?
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I said part time. I take pictures for me, and if someone else wants to buy prints that's fine. I wouldn't enjoy being told what to shoot, and I imagine it would be quite impractical to be a full time pro in that situation.
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Zou
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(Pooh-Bah)
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03/05/2008 21:28
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Re: New Poll - Dreams of being pro?
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Quote:
There are zillions of mediocre professional photographers out there.
Very true. A flick through even a Vogue level of mag shows that basic technique seems to be lacking. I was honestly shocked by how poor a recent GQ magazine cover was - Colin Farrell's ear was the only bit in focus - his eyes, nose etc were all off. No doubts the tog will say that was the desired effect, but, yeah, right.
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Re: New Poll - Dreams of being pro?
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Very well said!!!!
Quote:
When I first started out I would shoot anything to try and make money with my camera. Local sporting events, amateur dramatics, charity events and sold to the participants and their families. Shooting the dress rehearsal for am-dram was probably the most lucrative. For little outlay I would generate sales from each of the cast. I'd offered to do their publicity shots for free as a foot in the door.
I ran a successful wedding and portrait business for a couple of years but I lost interest, I was more of a salesman than a photographer. What really killed it off for me was trying to sell travel images, the ones that sold were just the same as everyone elses and the photos that I liked and enjoyed taking didn't sell. I ended up only shooting what I thought would sell and this change in direction was too much. Now it's strictly for fun only.
I don't think you have to be that good a photographer to make money with a camera, it's more down to hard work, persistance, a bit of luck and a bit of gab.
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Burgy
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(Grateful not to have one)
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03/05/2008 21:54
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Re: New Poll - Dreams of being pro?
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Errr
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Badgerman
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(Nocturnal Non-Scaredy Cat In A Deep Pit)
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03/05/2008 21:59
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Re: New Poll - Dreams of being pro?
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I love taking pictures of Wildlife for myself mainly, I spend hours watching and studying my subjects and will sometimes just watch and not take any pictures at all.
I do sell my work so I could be classed as semi-pro but I don’t always take the shots with this in mind.
I drive to my job each day and long to be out there photographing the wildlife instead of being cooped up in a bloomin factory.
I think that if I took the plunge and attempted to become a pro photographer, all the fun and pleasure I get would disappear and I would loose that magic feeling I get when I go out when I want to and not when I have to.
I will probably look back in a few years time and wonder if I should have gone for it but I am happy doing what I do and enjoy selling the odd print and getting work published is a bonus too.
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Re: New Poll - Dreams of being pro?
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Tried it once - didn't like it. Too many pregnant brides!
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Carrie
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(journeywoman)
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03/05/2008 23:51
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Re: New Poll - Dreams of being pro?
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I've always thought of a pro as being someone who takes photos that other people want, as opposed to an amateur who takes the photos that they want to.
On that basis I'm not quite sure what a semi-pro is, although badgerman's interpretation is a possibility.
Quote:
I do sell my work so I could be classed as semi-pro but I don’t always take the shots with this in mind.
I use photography as a bit of an escape from the day job, and would hate to lose that by trying to turn it into the day job.
On the other hand if I could earn a bit of money towards new kit by selling some of the photos that I take I'd be happy. I see that as still being amateur and not crossing that pro line.
The only thing I'd like about the pro tag is the access it gives to events etc that an amateur can't get.
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Hotblack
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(Dead Horse Flogger)
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04/05/2008 08:38
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Re: New Poll - Dreams of being pro?
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I suppose I could currently be classed as a semi-pro photographer. I shoot what I like and exhibit my work in galleries. I sell prints and cards of my images. I have another part time job which pays the bills but gives me the freedom to be out photographing when the weather/conditions are right. The money from photography pays for itself with a little excess beginning to arrive. I enjoy pretty much all of it, from being out taking the photographs, to producing the prints and getting work ready to exhibit. The actual exhibitions are great fun especially if you're an attention seeking tart like me.
I'd like to become full time under my terms as I love the way it works now. Whether that's feasible without turning to commercial work and that killing the passion I don't know. I'm just running with it whilst it's fun. I'm in a fortunate position in that I can always draw back if it gets tedious.
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Re: New Poll - Dreams of being pro?
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Quote:
Tried it once - didn't like it. Too many pregnant brides!
Ahh I can see where you were going wrong there - the discussions with the bride to be generally stop after you've settled on the type of album.
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sjaszczak
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(A Real Gentleman)
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04/05/2008 09:17
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Re: New Poll - Dreams of being pro?
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I selected "No"...however...
It would be nice to be able to take photographs that people would want to pay their hard-earned cash for (cash enabling me to hide it from the tax man of course  )
It would also be nice to have some small income from it to fund kit purchases...am saving my penies for the 70-200 F4 L IS...
But at the end of the day, that's where my ambition for professionalism ends...I'd much rather be an amateur.
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Re: New Poll - Dreams of being pro?
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Quote:
I suppose I could currently be classed as a semi-pro photographer. I shoot what I like and exhibit my work in galleries. I sell prints and cards of my images. I have another part time job which pays the bills but gives me the freedom to be out photographing when the weather/conditions are right. The money from photography pays for itself with a little excess beginning to arrive. I enjoy pretty much all of it, from being out taking the photographs, to producing the prints and getting work ready to exhibit. The actual exhibitions are great fun especially if you're an attention seeking tart like me.
I'd like to become full time under my terms as I love the way it works now. Whether that's feasible without turning to commercial work and that killing the passion I don't know. I'm just running with it whilst it's fun. I'm in a fortunate position in that I can always draw back if it gets tedious.
That's fine art photography, isn't it? The one branch where you produce what you like and the punters buy that. Like being a painter rather than an illustrator.
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Monobod
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('Phantom' of the forum!)
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04/05/2008 20:38
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Re: New Poll - Dreams of being pro?
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For me the answer is easy. A definite NO. I would hate to have to take photographs to meet a brief.
My photography sometimes has to meet deadlines, as I enter club competitions, but that is different to having always to deliver on time and within budjet.
It is not for me.
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Re: New Poll - Dreams of being pro?
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I should like to earn some money from photography, but in the current economic climate I would not even think about starting a business, and I suppose in order to make money you need to be and run a business. And echoing what a lot of others have said I think if I relied on Photography for a living,apart from it being exceptionally hard work, I would not get the same pleasure from it and I suppose I would find myself photograping stuff I had no interest in? And how do you get good shots of people who have a good face for Radio? And then theres the legions out there who say "why does it cost so much when I can get a 4 by 6 for 15p" or whatever! I think trying to be a pro would do my head in, rapidly!
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Hotblack
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(Dead Horse Flogger)
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04/05/2008 22:37
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Re: New Poll - Dreams of being pro?
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Quote:
Quote:
I suppose I could currently be classed as a semi-pro photographer. I shoot what I like and exhibit my work in galleries. I sell prints and cards of my images. I have another part time job which pays the bills but gives me the freedom to be out photographing when the weather/conditions are right. The money from photography pays for itself with a little excess beginning to arrive. I enjoy pretty much all of it, from being out taking the photographs, to producing the prints and getting work ready to exhibit. The actual exhibitions are great fun especially if you're an attention seeking tart like me.
I'd like to become full time under my terms as I love the way it works now. Whether that's feasible without turning to commercial work and that killing the passion I don't know. I'm just running with it whilst it's fun. I'm in a fortunate position in that I can always draw back if it gets tedious.
That's fine art photography, isn't it? The one branch where you produce what you like and the punters buy that. Like being a painter rather than an illustrator.
Yep!! 
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zx9
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(old hand)
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05/05/2008 15:07
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Re: New Poll - Dreams of being pro?
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Turn pro, no way, I am already self-employed doing something that I enjoy.
Anyway I can't even take pictures for the competitions here never mind working to someone else's brief.
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Re: New Poll - Dreams of being pro?
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I would love to, depending on specialization. I would hate to be a wedding photographer, even though I have done that for a while, it's good money for a days work, but no, too stressful, I wouldn't be able to specialise in that. I have done bars and businesses, they tend to be quick jobs, again good money for what it is, but they make me feel artistically numb,birthdays and other occasions, but again no matter how creative I can be with them, I like to have more scope for creativity. I would love though, to specialise nature and or documentary photography and a bit of press stuff (current affairs and other newsworthy stuff, not the dumb pap stuff that some consider press stuff, I personally don't). Yep I would love to turn pro in that, yes. I also love my fine art stuff and I have had people buying stuff (my website is being redesigned and in the backburner for now, to include a wider range of my work so things gone a bit slow) but I guess I would like to keep that for myself. I would also love to work in an editorial picture desk.
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Wheelu
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(member)
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05/05/2008 20:36
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Re: New Poll - Dreams of being pro?
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Quote:
Nothing like doing it for a living to kill your enthusiasm.
Couldn't agree more. I don't mind dabbling with Amaly a bit, but, having taken a few family weddings, I would not want to make a living doing that!
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cpfc12
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(newbie)
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06/05/2008 12:23
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Re: New Poll - Dreams of being pro?
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Love to have been an old fashioned beach photographer, complete with old Russian camera of some sort. Little hut by the pier and the bar, with an ice cream seller nearby for exceptionaly hot days. Bournemouth would do very nicely. Digital has ruined all that too. Shame. Er, what was the question? Put me down as a no.
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El Sid
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(Going potty)
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07/05/2008 16:28
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Re: New Poll - Dreams of being pro?
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I'd love to be in a position to be able to spend all day behind a camera.........but I don't think I'd want it to be a position where I have to spend all day behind a camera.......... 
Makes me a 'No' with just a soupcon of 'Part Time Pro' hankering.....
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Monobod
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('Phantom' of the forum!)
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08/05/2008 10:42
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Re: New Poll - Dreams of being pro?
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I would like, perhaps, to arrange a small exhibition of my best photos and offer them for sale. The small income from such a thing would help finance some more photography. Really, what is nice is being able to show ones work to others. Surely, that is also part of the pleasure of photography.
But to have to do it to earn a crust would not be my choice.
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Re: New Poll - Dreams of being pro?
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Photography is essential to my work, and I spend much of my time taking and editing those photographs. I also use professional quality equipment, but does that make me a professional?
In truth, I would like to spend more time taking photographs where and when I want, and not having to write supporting reports; but unless I was exceptionally talented, and could sell my photographs for £ hundreds each, I really don't think I would want to make my living that way. It would just be too much like hard work.
And as for wedding photography, forget it!
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Learning
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(Ethelred the Ill-Named)
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08/05/2008 20:30
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Re: New Poll - Dreams of being pro?
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No. Being a pro would make photography a job. Something to do to earn a lving. Something to do well enough but no better.
Being amateur is to photograph what I want when I want and the way I want. I can afford the time to do it the way I want.
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Re: New Poll - Dreams of being pro?
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In my personal opinion, I think that there is the slightly misconcepted view that because you are a pro you can't shoot what you want and you are somewhat constrained by the demands of your job. What if you are actually making a living shooting what you want? I had a small seminar with some photojournalists at my University, Sean Smith was one of them and I could say that despite all of the stresses of the job, it is what they want and they love it. Sean Smith's work for example is instantly recognisable, has a personal style (and a very good one at that) and has creative flair. He manages to tell a whole story in one frame.
I think it pretty much depends what kind of photography work you end up doing. As I said, I would hate ending up doing wedding photography, but there are also quite a few out there that love it and make a good living out of it.
It's all a bit subjective.
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Re: New Poll - Dreams of being pro?
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Quote:
In my personal opinion, I think that there is the slightly misconcepted view that because you are a pro you can't shoot what you want and you are somewhat constrained by the demands of your job. What if you are actually making a living shooting what you want? I had a small seminar with some photojournalists at my University, Sean Smith was one of them and I could say that despite all of the stresses of the job, it is what they want and they love it. Sean Smith's work for example is instantly recognisable, has a personal style (and a very good one at that) and has creative flair. He manages to tell a whole story in one frame.
I think it pretty much depends what kind of photography work you end up doing. As I said, I would hate ending up doing wedding photography, but there are also quite a few out there that love it and make a good living out of it.
It's all a bit subjective.
But if your type of photography didn't pay the bills you would have no choice but to photograph to other people's briefs.
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Burgy
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(Grateful not to have one)
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09/05/2008 00:31
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Re: New Poll - Dreams of being pro?
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There is always room for a pro to shoot what he wants as well as shooting the brief.
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BrianT
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(Old Hand)
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09/05/2008 10:46
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Re: New Poll - Dreams of being pro?
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I find the subject of work of any kind so tedious.
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Re: New Poll - Dreams of being pro?
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Quote:
I find the subject of work of any kind so tedious.
Now there are REAL words of wisdom.
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Re: New Poll - Dreams of being pro?
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Quote:
Quote:
I find the subject of work of any kind so tedious.
Now there are REAL words of wisdom.
I love work ... I can watch people doing it for hours and hours.
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Re: New Poll - Dreams of being pro?
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Quote:
Quote:
Tried it once - didn't like it. Too many pregnant brides!
Ahh I can see where you were going wrong there - the discussions with the bride to be generally stop after you've settled on the type of album.
Used to get a few christenings though!
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Re: New Poll - Dreams of being pro?
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don't get me wrong - being a professional photographer is a hobbyist's dream. however, if you have a stable and good paying day job, such dreams are, sadly, put on the drawing board.
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